[ 00:00:12 ]joined today by my co-host Bob Payton to my left with BobPayton.com. Thank you, sir. I’m Adam Hayes with the Hayes Group. Today we’re joined by our guest, Paul Schwartz of Hoosier Shooting Academy. Welcome to the show. Welcome. Thank you. Appreciate you guys having me. Yeah.

 

[ 00:00:26 ]So tell us, what is Hoosier Shooting Academy? Surprisingly, it’s a basketball facility. I get a lot of Second Amendment people coming. I bet you do. It’s a gun range. Do they show up ready to shoot? I’m surprised. I really thought I was going to have some kind of protest, like something was going to happen in the news and people were going to show up. And I’m like, whoa, whoa, whoa. If you can see the logo right here, it’s a basketball. So I’m like, you’re having a lot of marks to get to that conclusion. I did that intentionally. It looks like an old-school musket bullet.

 

[ 00:00:56 ]It could have been a bullseye.

 

[ 00:01:01 ]We’re just messing with you, man. You guys were very athletic in high school, I can tell.

 

[ 00:01:05 ]I played all sports in high school, so I get it.

 

[ 00:01:09 ]I did that, though, because of the mental ability of like you hear one thing and then when you get shifted, it proved wrong. Yeah. Yeah. When you hear it again, you’re like, no, I’m not going to think of a gun again.

 

[ 00:01:18 ]Can you take your mic and kind of move it towards you a little bit?

 

[ 00:01:20 ]There we go.

 

[ 00:01:21 ]There you go.

 

[ 00:01:21 ]My bad. Got it. So we’ll edit that out with your hands in here.

 

[ 00:01:25 ]No. Yeah. I’m Italian. So it’s all good. So tell us about the Hoosier Shooting Academy.

 

[ 00:01:33 ]I’m going to get on my soapbox when I say this. Sure. And I’m going to own it. The Europeaners, when they play basketball, they’re practicing five times, five times, and they’re playing one game. Here in America, we play five games and we practice once. And it’s been going on for a decade. And I was a high school coach. I’ve done player development. I’ve worked with 40, 30, 40 guys in the NBA, thousands of college players. um, all stars from everyone in between. And I’m just taking the higher level stuff that we taught those guys and giving it to third graders, giving it to fourth graders and really breaking it down. And what I want is young kids to be able to get that same development that Luca and Jokic and all those guys are getting, uh, at a young age. So we have, it’s never been done. It’s a half court and got 14 baskets, 16 doctor dishes. um what’s a doctor dish it’s basically a rebounding machine and what it could do is like you get out there and you can shoot and it’ll tell you hey paul you made 100 out of 200 you shot 50 and there’s just what you could do it almost has a peloton like feel where that it will tell you what to do Like a Peloton bike would, but imagine that for basketball.

 

[ 00:02:46 ]Okay.

 

[ 00:02:46 ]Dr. Dish. Dr. Dish.

 

[ 00:02:48 ]You’re getting dished to, right? Yeah. Dumping the ball to you.

 

[ 00:02:52 ]Absolutely.

 

[ 00:02:53 ]In the past, past Dish. That’s pretty cool.

 

[ 00:02:55 ]How long you done it and where’s it at? So I have done basketball for going on almost 20 years. I was a college coach for two years, a high school coach. I was a head coach. And I just really didn’t feel like that was hitting the mark. I just felt like there was something more. And so I’ve done this now. I’ve actually started planning it for eight years. Like I have been traveling. I see something, I take it. I see something I did like, I take it. I see something I didn’t like. I, you know, I don’t want that. And so doing that is really, it kind of made me pick and choose what I wanted to incorporate and not incorporate. So that’s kind of like where people ask like, Oh, how long did it take you? It took me eight years just to come up with a concept. Right. And so, you know, you plant a seed and you just, water until you get something um and then there’s a i’ve done the business now i’m going on four years congrats so we’ve made it we’re going into the fifth year and uh no we’re going into sorry apologize we’re going into year four we’ve done three years but we’re going into year four um and it’s been phenomenal it’s been phenomenal lost a lot of hair and there’s been a lot of stress on yeah surviving a lot of different things but I’m learning because I didn’t get into it from the business world where I was hey I’m a business person transitioning into another business I’m a basketball coach and a PE teacher transitioning into a CEO love it and so there’s been a lot of a lot of learning So a lot of learning. We call that the cost of education.

 

[ 00:04:27 ]It’s drinking from the fire hose. So where is the Hoosier Shooting Academy?

 

[ 00:04:31 ]It is right outside Brookville and 52. It is on the southeast side of Indianapolis. Okay. Towards New Pal. Right outside New Pal. Thank you. New Pal guy. Still there? No. Okay. Zionsville. No, you left.

 

[ 00:04:45 ]Yeah, I did.

 

[ 00:04:47 ]And I intentionally did that, though, because I wanted to go to a market where nobody else was going to compete with me. I went to the vacuum. I did all my research and said, hey, on the north side, we have all this. South side, we’re building out. So I went to a place where there was no facility. Now, mind you, I’m going against the grain, going with player development, because kids don’t want to train. Parents don’t want to train. They want to play, play, play. But then on top of that, I’m also going Instagram because I’m going where there is no facility. Sure. So I’m kind of swimming up river with both of those. But I’ve learned a lot. I’ve learned a lot.

 

[ 00:05:28 ]Do you think in the end, I mean, you’re three years in, was that a smart move at this point?

 

[ 00:05:34 ]Yes and no. Okay.

 

[ 00:05:37 ]Yes and no. That’s good.

 

[ 00:05:38 ]I love my clientele, but there is a bit of, You know, sometimes you can see, well, maybe if I would have went to the north side, I probably would have had more of an influx wave. I would have gone farther south. But I would say it’s good. It was good. So let me grow.

 

[ 00:05:54 ]I love being different. Yeah. I mean, being different is better than better.

 

[ 00:05:57 ]I mean, the cool thing, you were intentional about what you were doing. It’s not like you just went there and went, oh, this market sucks. You intentionally carved out that niche for yourself. And I wanted that.

 

[ 00:06:09 ]I really wanted that. I could have pursued a lot of my former NBA guys and, you know, really tried to get them back involved. Like, ah, come on. But for me, I’m the kind of person I would take a third grader. I want to take a third grader and get that third grader to the NBA. I want to take that, you know, hey, your kid got cut in the second grade, fourth grade, fifth grade. You come to me and now we’re playing to college.

 

[ 00:06:30 ]So kids are getting cut in second grade now.

 

[ 00:06:33 ]Wow. No, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no, no.

 

[ 00:06:37 ]Yeah.

 

[ 00:06:38 ]I mean, the elite teams, and I mean, I had a kid, I won’t say any names, but I had a third grader come to me, and I was working with him, and I pulled him aside. Hey, you’re not doing it. You’re not getting it. Like, I need a lot more effort. You’re not doing it. And he looked at me and said, I’m ranked in the top 40 for third graders.

 

[ 00:06:59 ]And I feel like this top rank third grader. Who’s publishing that ranking? A whole other business. A whole other business. It wasn’t max preps, clearly, right?

 

[ 00:07:11 ]No, no. It was just another third-party thing in the Midwest that they do. And then I kind of step back, and I’m like, Who are you? I’ve worked out with Greg Oden. I’ve worked out with Mike. I’ve got number one draft picks. Go away. Go away. When you get a number one draft pick, I’m not worried a 36-ranked third grader. And you probably would have been number one if you would have worked harder. But anyway, since that conversation, he showed up. He’s worked harder. But, I mean, it’s just been an honest, like, dude, you ain’t getting it done. This is exactly what you’re doing right. You’re not doing it. And a lot of parents don’t appreciate those conversations. You know, you know, he’s like, Hey, your son’s not performing. He’s not the best court. And a lot of times now in America, okay. Well, your kid’s not the top score, but we’ll just jump over here and he’ll be the top score over here. And so it’s one of those, like, it’s just kind of like the kids transfer portal. Yes. Right. Oh, Hey, you can do right. Yeah. So it’s, um, and I get it. If you’re in an abusive situation, if you’re in a toxic situation, I’m absolutely for it. Get out. But like, It’s not toxic if you’re being challenged. It’s not toxic if you’re giving creative feedback. You have no left hand. In the basketball world, there’s coaching trees, and you can follow all the way from Nate Smith all the way down to Calipari. Calipari worked for Schilling, and Schilling was the guy that mentored me. And so you can follow that tree all the way down. I had a conversation with Calipari one time and we were talking about it and he goes, yeah, well, if you can’t dribble with your left hand over here, you know, Western State University, what things should we have come to Kentucky? And you think your left hand is going to develop because you’re in Kentucky? Like they’re going to, they’re going to expose you more. And so now you see a lot of kids that are becoming more deficient because of the culture that we have here. So that was kind of the end game of where we went with it. You see a guy like Giannis, you see a lot of Jokic, you see a lot of Shies. Tim, Johnny, and Chris aren’t going to win MVPs anymore. Back about 20 years ago, one out of every 20 NBA guys was a Europeaner. Now it’s one out of every three. Pretty soon it’s going to be one American out of every three Europeans. For me, instead of trying to attack from the NBA level, let’s attack it at the grassroots level and go from there. That’s kind of the long story about how I got here.

 

[ 00:09:34 ]So what are you thinking about this year? What are you looking forward to this year?

 

[ 00:09:40 ]Walking away for a little bit. Yeah. Walking away. I know it sounds weird. Just taking a break. And going on year three, I mean, I’ve worked multiple 14-hour days, multiple, like, just, you know, just craziness. Sure. I talked to my staff this week, or last month, I should say. I told him the big conversation I had was I’ve built three years of fighting for a culture. It’s not culture if I’m the only one doing it. The culture needs to walk on its own. You guys need to pick the culture up. So I’m going to step away, and I’m going to give you guys a job, and the job is expected to be done. And, man, there was a day, there was a time where it just broke me. It just broke me. I was doing spring break camps, and I worked 14 12-hour days in a row. And around day eight, I just remember looking up like, I can’t do this anymore. I can’t. I can’t. And so I started. That was my breaking point. And anybody that starts a business, you’re going to get to a breaking point. You’re going to get. You bet. Either you’re going to shut the business down or you’re going to change. Stubborn is going to get you beaten. And I finally had a moment where I was looking like, Stubborn is beating me right now. So after that, I started putting together job titles. you know this is what i need to be successful and talking my language now but it was great because i picked up all the things i didn’t want to do right and then i gave it to i brought somebody on staff and said this is your job they’ve done really well with this so um it’s now to a point where i’m probably gonna work uh a minimum hours this this for the first time in three years i’m gonna show up do my job and leave you know um but i know that’s counterproductive that’s probably not what it is it’s exactly what you need to be doing so we’ll talk about that later yeah it’s ripping the band-aid off in a good way yes sir oh yeah yeah and my wife is i’m super ocd and and i’m sure you know and mary you you you know what your wife wants yeah yeah so now it’s funny because i’ll come back and like oh you know this person didn’t paint the law i wanted and she goes no

 

[ 00:11:43 ]That’s a good learning opportunity, though, for both of you. You on how to coach them and them on how to understand what you’re driving for.

 

[ 00:11:52 ]And you have to let them play. I mean, it’s just like the kids. You have to let them play. And with my staff, I have to let them fail. No question. I know it’s going to cost me money. At the long term, you lose a little bit, but you gain a bit on the back end.

 

[ 00:12:07 ]No question. Let’s break down this methodology some more. So what makes it so important? Why is there such a stark difference between the way that we teach and learn basketball in the United States versus in Europe? Let me ask you a question real quick.

 

[ 00:12:23 ]I don’t know if we just met. You have kids, right? Yeah. Do you have kids? Yes. Imagine if your kids came home every day and said, hey, I’m in high school. I have seven courses. And they took seven tests on Monday. And then they turned around and took another seven tests on Tuesday. Another seven tests on Wednesday, Thursday. And then Friday was the first time they actually spent studying. You’d probably lose your mind as a parent. You just tested my kid. When you play the game, it’s a test. And you need to go back and you need to watch the film and study. Right now, I’m a big Pacers fan. And so we’re in the playoffs. And so I’m studying as a coach. okay we turned the ball over but why did we turn the ball over what was that reason right and that’s going back and studying or that’s going back and studying and then you step on the court and you try to simulate this is where we lost the ball this is what we’re going to do different and so you’re trying to train that so on the court what we do is we just say oh we lost by 14. oh guess what we lost one by two but my question is though why why what is the actual demeanor and so um i have a kid i I don’t do this with everybody, but this kid came to me at three and a half. And now he’s in the fifth grade going into sixth grade. So I think that would translate to about eight years, going eight and a half years. And when I develop them, it’s not just going in there and hoping something works out. I’m studying Chris Paul. I’m studying Stephen Curry. I’m studying the elite point guards. I’m studying, you know, what are these guys doing that this kid can do? So, you know, the first little bit was, we’re just going to get the ball to the rim. Just happy you made a basket. Then after that, let’s do some contact. Then let’s get some dribbling down. Let’s get a spin move down. And now I’m getting to the point where he has a great finish. He can dribble the ball. And now I need to work on his passing. And so for us, and I guess for me at the HSA and the Europeaners, they’re building Luka and they’re building Jokic with this destination in mind. Boom, boom, boom, step one, two, three, four, five. In America, we just, you know. Drill, per se? They just play.

 

[ 00:14:24 ]Yeah.

 

[ 00:14:25 ]Let’s get seven games. Let’s just get seven games on the schedule and let’s just play all seven. And do you actually go back and watch the film? Do you go back and study what you did wrong? Are you in on top of that? Are you or are you just getting your dad ripping you on the way home? Like, well, you can’t do this and this and this. There’s a lot of that. There’s not supportive of getting doesn’t.

 

[ 00:14:47 ]Yeah. And I have a story about that. Yeah. I coached Little League softball or baseball for several years. Lots of parents. I’m sure. Yeah.

 

[ 00:14:57 ]So it was interesting, though. And again, there’s a bit of me. I have a seven-year-old son. And when he was four, he played in a little basketball league. The room was about this tall. And the ball’s on the ground, and all the kids are looking at each other. And my son just has the tenacity of, like, I’m going to pick the ball up and put it in the net because that’s what I see my dad watch on TV. And it wasn’t like he was doing anything special. He comes in there and scores the first seven points. And everyone’s like, oh, that’s the next LeBron. Oh, John Moran. And I’m like, calm down. He’s fourth. And so eventually we get to the point. And I’m coaching, so I’m trying to get everybody to – I’m trying to get everybody, you know, let’s give everybody a shot. And so – He gets the ball. And I’m like, Anderson, pass it to Johnny. He looks at me and goes, no. And I’m like, who are you? And so the next time he does it, he waves me off. And the third time he does it, he just ignores me. So I bring him in. I’m like, hey, bud, come here. I need you to pass the ball to Johnny. Okay, dad, I love you. I love you too, son. Pass the ball to Johnny, okay? fourth time he drives it and it doesn’t pass the jacket and my wife is over here losing her mind and she’s like coach take them out do this do that and i’m like ma’am i don’t know who you are but you need to calm down like i’m not listening to this someone get this parent it’s crazy mom so anyway i get in the car my dude this is my son’s first game wow i rip him I ripped my four-year-old. So when the coach tells you to do something, to do something, you pass it to Johnny. And mind you, I’m a coach. I’ve been doing this 17 years. The first thing I do in the car is the first thing I said I would never do. And I pull out of the parking lot here and look for it in the background. And I’m like, I’m that guy. And so I didn’t even make it a full year. I made it one game and I had to rip my son. And so now when they get home. It’s asking three questions. Did you try as best you could? Did you work hard? Sure. Did you listen? Did you have fun? Those are the only three things I care about. And so I just don’t think – I tell parents all the time, my job is to be the bad guy as a coach. Like, you know, you give me your son, give me your daughter, let me be the one that’s hard on them, and then you get them in the car and you say, hey, what did Coach Paul – he’s a jerk. He said some mean things. Did he say anything inappropriate? No. okay well now listen and then you get to be a dad again you know and that’s what i want parents to understand is it’s let me be the bad guy let me be the guy that goes in there and rips everybody and i’m showing my tail and then you get in the car and you get to be dad and then i’m struggling with my son now because he’s seven do i be coach or my dad like i can’t play both sides of the fence you have to be one so yes and i think and again this is the hypothetical in europe i’m pretty sure that the professionals are the professionals you you bring your kid to a trainer and off you go there you go you’re paying them to do a job get the job done so yeah yeah interesting what what’s some of the most significant challenges you’ve dealt with along the way over the last three years um man that’s a lot that’s a lot um i’m gonna pick the top three that’s fine right my daughter got diagnosed with cancer my first year in the business my daughter so that was probably not probably easily the biggest challenge um and people ask me who my hero is my wife and my daughter yeah like you know they beat cancer and i’m very proud of that so um i’m in a fraternity i’m a very proud member sigma from you um i’m actually the chapter advisor at iu and when i tell the guys you know i’m rambling to them about you know what you got to do i’m like understand how you treat your fraternities is how you’re going to treat your wife is how you’re going to treat your family your business or everything you do, you know, it all starts here. How I treated the basketball as a player is how I treated my fraternity. It’s how I treat my job is how I treat my wife. So it’s something I take a lot of pride in and, you know, drilling into people that, you know, when my daughter got cancer, it was, you got to trust your Lord. You have to trust your systems. You know, you can’t, you can’t just lose your mind because my job, I’m still the CEO of a business and then they’re doing all that. So. But at the same time, I also didn’t hide it. People would come in and, you know, I’d say they would be upset about something. I’m like, what’s wrong with this daughter? You know, this girl. Well, I failed a test. Well, to her, her world is that test. It’s not cancer, but she doesn’t know any different. So I need to be responsive of like, well, you’re seeing me go through the hardest thing I’ve ever had to go through in my life. I show up to work. I’m positive. And I used it. as a learning tool for the kids of like, I didn’t hide it. I was like, no, don’t talk about it. It was, you know, Hey, you know, you go, you had a bad day, you find cancer. So, um, not to be sarcastic with them or anything, but you know, no, but it also gives them perspective too. Yeah. Right. And, and so, uh, that would be the hardest thing. Um, the next hardest thing is, is staff, like just find the people, quality people. Um, I’m a big pusher and component of, of I support the youth. um everybody everybody under the age of 21 has been phenomenal to work with really wow i had a single issue with somebody over 21. under 21.

 

[ 00:20:13 ]25 and older is the only problem that i have everyone over 25 has been the one that yeah wow um that’s been the one i’m like yeah we used to we used to talk about the millennials now it’s gen z’s right i mean now there’s yeah we’re starting to exactly that shift is happening i just think it’s difficult though because i mean

 

[ 00:20:29 ]at the end of the day i’ve always believed this everybody wants to be listened to everybody wants to be loved and everybody wants to be appreciated it doesn’t matter who you are like you know any room you walk into everybody wants to be loved they want to be heard and they want to be appreciated and so if you build that relationship with the youth i mean my guys will run through walls for me um and i joke around with them a lot and i don’t say anything inappropriate but like i make fun of them you know they make fun of me back and it’s it’s a good relationship but I know at the end of the day, when I say run through that wall, they’ll do it without even thinking twice. And then on top of that, finding guys that are willing to fill in our system. I would say cancer and then staffing issues would be, not issues, but just finding people that fight for the culture.

 

[ 00:21:16 ]How many is on your team?

 

[ 00:21:17 ]I have one part-time guy that he runs all my office stuff. And then I have Six. Six part-time little college students that work around and do their jobs. But at the same time, I’m also looking at them to say, one thing I sit down in the interview process, and I’ve had a lot of people, and I’m sure you start a business, you have 500 people just coming at you for everything. I want to do this. I want to do that. And I’m always looking for a win-win. I’ve had a lot of people that got my attention. They say, well, I’m going to do all this for you. I’m going to go, what do you want back from me? I don’t want nothing. I don’t believe that. I don’t believe that. I want a phone call. I want you to make a connection. I want you to do something. And I think that when you look for something, I mean, even now, my staff, why are you doing all this? Because you get a paycheck. That’s the win-win. I get this. You get a paycheck. And I don’t like bringing people on that don’t have a long-term goal. I want to bring people on that. There was a guy that I was recruiting, and I wanted him to come work for me, a really good friend of mine. but i also made it known that like if you’re still working for me in three years i failed you as a ceo i should have had you in the nba i should have had you you know doing something i don’t want you here in three years like my job is to use this as a stepping stone i’m getting something from you but at the same time you’re getting contacts and you know job experience that you would need to grow on so and then um the third one would probably be my there was a company next to me that power washed under the wall and ruined my oh boy oh and i’m in the middle of it unexpected i’m in the middle of doing it out with them right now it’s just one of those things you just don’t expect and you know i talk to the youth and you know like people like oh well you know and then i did it when i was a little kid so i’m not throwing stones when oh well you’re just saying this because you’re up here and i’m down here and you know you’re talking down to me and i make kids know and i make i kind of like

 

[ 00:23:10 ]i’m on the same level everything i’m ripping you about right now i did the same thing this morning i’m not anything better i just don’t have someone older than me yelling at me right so you know showing the kids that you’re holding yourself accountable too so um yeah those would be the top three that’s good yeah so let’s get to know you a little bit what’s your story how’d you get into you know basketball and did you grow up in indiana and all that let’s go let’s go from wherever you want to pick that story up I was born in Arizona.

 

[ 00:23:38 ]I lived there for eight years. Spain for a year, Germany two years, Italy three years. I joke around telling them that my dad was the president of a yacht club. you know it was military it was not a yacht club so but i normally i let it sit there for a little bit everyone thinks walks around for like an hour like yeah club in arizona i would totally lie too i mean kind of feels like no you build them in land because it’s cheaper and then you drive them down the river anyway I could totally make her some wine on the way. And I would have some force bought on that. But so, and then after that moved to Florida and Florida is really, when I went to high school and college, and then I’m originally from Pensacola. And it’s even weird because even coming from those areas, I was wanting to be an Indian all-star. It’s kind of like asking people like, you know, like, Hey, you went to, you want to win the lottery? I was like, yeah, I want to win the lottery. Do you play? no right how could i be from florida you know being an all-star just doesn’t make sense but that’s this is the mecca of basketball and so um bottom line is i worked for a fraternity and the fraternity brought me up here to be a field rep for them okay and so i would just play basketball every day and then uh one day i saw a gentleman and his son playing and you know they were doing a dad and son thing we’ve all done it you know i want you to do this i want to do that and so they were just you know and so eventually they stepped off the court it was one of those like hey we’re not we’re not doing this right now and so i approached the dad i’ve never done this before in my life i’m like can i work out with your son a little bit like just and the dad’s like ah sure so i go to the kid like hey you want to shoot around a little bit kids like not pound sand and i’m like okay i’ll go walk away so i go in there shoot around about five minutes to get pokes his head in and it comes around and then um eventually i start working out with him i see the dad you know keep an eye make sure i’m not you know yeah some random guy in the gym yeah yeah and um after i get done the dad says hey i played in the nba and uh i own a training facility you know i want to get you involved and so that was literally my first step how i got into coaching like didn’t do anything and um So then after that, I traveled around, and the fraternity made connections for me. Bernie Fine, who was an assistant at Syracuse for a while, made some calls for me because we’re in the same fraternity. He said, hey, I got this guy who doesn’t know nothing. And then after that, I was an assistant coach at a junior college, and then I went to Mississippi as a college coach. And didn’t like college, wasn’t a fan of it. It’s just all recruiting. It’s 90% recruiting, and I was just like, I want to be on the floor doing things. So moved up here. I worked for a gentleman, Ed Schilling, who was at IU. He’s now the head coach at Pepperdine. He was with the Nets in Memphis with Kyle Parry. And so I just studied. I worked for him for four years. Just studied the game under him and, you know, made a lot of his connections that he did. He went to UCLA, and my wife was like, hey, you’re not going to California. We’re staying here in Indiana.

 

[ 00:26:46 ]Smart.

 

[ 00:26:48 ]So I was one of those like, okay, well, you know, this kind of limits my abilities as a coach. So I was a high school coach, and then eventually I ended up at Morristown with Scott McClellan, who’s at Noblesville now. And he just, he let me have my way. He let me coach and say what I want to say, do what I want to say, push the guys. And we got along really, really well. And then that kind of sparked me to join, to start the facility. So yeah, yeah. I’ve kind of been everywhere doing everything.

 

[ 00:27:18 ]Right. That’s awesome. Yeah. Love the story.

 

[ 00:27:20 ]So tell us about the beard.

 

[ 00:27:22 ]Yeah.

 

[ 00:27:23 ]All right.

 

[ 00:27:24 ]Beard story.

 

[ 00:27:26 ]I had a contract to run with some money. That’s the end of it. That’s kind of where it ends. But kind of Quentin Tarantino, this thing starting. He just wasn’t getting the job done. He just, oh, we’re going to be ready for this, ready for that. And again, anybody starting a business, this is what you have to know. And if I were to sit down and start, you know, I have a contractor. Okay. Realize if you get them $10 tomorrow, you need to see $10 worth of product in your space. Right. I didn’t know that. No, I need this. I need this. I need this. And then something would show up, but it wasn’t $10 worth. You know, I gave him a thousand dollars. It wasn’t a thousand. It’d be a hundred dollars worth. So eventually he ended up getting me for a good amount. And so what I did is when I think it was like January, I’m like, you know what? I’m just going to grow this beard and just to see if he picks up on like, this is how late we are. I started growing this beard. You told me, you told me this project was going to be a week late. and so i started growing the beard and it ended up being three months late and i think i had it down here and um and so you know you go through life and you have little reminders about things um and so that was why i grew the beard was to kind of get him like i want to get a shirt and just have it labeled and like how late we are right he he eventually i finally woke up i’m more like he ran with the money like he’s not coming back yeah so um i like the beer and so i kept it but there’s a little bit of a mark of you know this reminds me yeah it’s a scar yeah it’s a scar of like you know not everyone’s going to be on your side you’re this is a business um you you can’t always take care of everybody and you have to watch out for yourself and you know reminds me of i’m still the boss yeah it’s just that’s a great story so what do you do for fun what hobbies do you have oh i picked up golf okay yeah now we’re talking my wife forced me to pick up golf um a because i coach basketball all day i come home i play basketball i watch basketball and then i’m talking about basketball and my wife finally comes up to me and says like what are you doing that’s not basketball because every time i watch a facial game last night i don’t know why i do this myself as a fan like i lost sleep after the game i was like i gotta gotta find something to do because i’m so worked up and she’s like well i mean you don’t see a common thread here and so golf is my one out that is not basketball My wife’s grandpa lived to 101. He was a week short of 101. He played golf every day for 30 years. Once he retired, six days a week, walked 18 holes. Wow. Walked. So he’s been golfing since he was 14. No, 13.

 

[ 00:29:58 ]When he first picked up a golf course. He’s one of those guys that carried three sticks with him instead of 18 sticks.

 

[ 00:30:03 ]The longer you talk, the more I wouldn’t be surprised. Right. But I look at him and I’m like, man. Like, there’s got to be something with this golf thing. How long have you been playing? Two years. Okay, same here. It’s a very toxic relationship. It is. And I go back every time. It just takes one shot out of 18 holes.

 

[ 00:30:23 ]Usually I hit two out of 18. Give me a break. You played with me last year. I’m not good. You know that.

 

[ 00:30:29 ]Oh, come on. He’s one of those guys, like you play you, girl. I haven’t played in years. I don’t know what I’m doing. And he just wipes you out. No.

 

[ 00:30:38 ]But I’m not good. I’m not good. I’m not.

 

[ 00:30:40 ]It’s all right. It’s all right.

 

[ 00:30:42 ]I’ve never hit this many holes in once. I’ve never chipped it in from 75. Never.

 

[ 00:30:49 ]Measure of success in your first or second year is how many balls do you have when you’re done? Score doesn’t matter.

 

[ 00:30:59 ]I’m a little twisted, though, because when I golf, I pick up them because everyone drives and they just drive by them. I probably gain five every time I golf. Well, that’s great.

 

[ 00:31:08 ]It keeps you from buying them. Anything else? Hobby right now?

 

[ 00:31:14 ]I don’t want to sound cheesy, but family. That’s not cheesy. We just had our fourth daughter born last month. Congratulations. That’s four now. And I don’t know if that would be considered a hobby, but, you know. Oh, it can be. Yeah. It’s an expensive and time

 

[ 00:31:32 ]-consuming one for sure.

 

[ 00:31:33 ]But all joking aside, I do – everybody asks me, like, why did I start this? I mean, here I am, a successful coach. I could have been a head coach and, you know, done this. And it’s really weird because it’s a year ago now that I’m talking. It was eight years – seven years ago. My mom got diagnosed with cancer. And Mother’s Day called her, and she just went off the deep end about some stuff and called my dad. And he goes, well, your mom’s on her deathbed. You need to get down here. And I’m like, whoa, didn’t expect that. So I get in the plane. I fly down there one Monday morning, fly back Monday night. And as I’m flying back Monday night, my wife calls me. And we have a rule in the house. You call twice, you pick up. Those are the rules. So even if my wife calls me now twice, you pick up. Mine’s once, by the way. Mine’s twice too. So I get on the plane. She calls me and I’m sitting down like ignore. She calls me again. I’m like, okay, what do you want? She goes, my water just broke. And I’m like, Ooh, excuse me. What? Like, and so literally we’re talking all the way. And I get, I lose service because we’re, we’re, we left. I know every TSA will shut up. I, they kicked off the plane and banned from traveling now, but get home. And then my son is born. My first son. And then my mom dies the very next day.

 

[ 00:32:51 ]Oh, man.

 

[ 00:32:52 ]And for me, I always want to live a life that I can tell my children what to do. Because like, oh, well, dad, life is hard. Well, everything’s hard. But what happened to you? Well, I want to coach in the NBA. Why didn’t you do it? Because it got hard. Right. I can’t say I’m coaching in the NBA, but right now I have a very close second, if not, you know, 1.2 or 1.B. it’s just one of those and my mom died with a lot of regrets on the table where she was she wanted to travel she always wanted to retire she wanted to like you know live like a hippie life a gypsy of just traveling and seeing the world and she never did that and so for me that’s one thing that really sparked the business that was kind of the tipping point of everything where i was just like i i can’t keep doing this lifestyle like i’m not it’s not bad but it’s not what i want so yeah um nothing i think i was doing crazy but it just wasn’t pursuing my goal of what I wanted. So, uh, yeah, that, that was one thing that, you know, that’s one reason why I say my family and, you know, I want to be able to look at my boys one day and say, Hey, you need to work harder. And they’ll look at me and be like, well, dad works pretty hard. So, okay, we’ll do it. So I don’t want to be the dad. That’s all we need to work harder. What do you know about that? That’s right.

 

[ 00:34:05 ]Calm down a little bit. Just sitting around all day. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, what you described, I think is the, probably the semi-universal story of why people start businesses. Yeah. Right. Variety of reasons, but in the end, they’re not satisfied with what they’re doing and that it was bad. It just wasn’t good enough. I can get behind that. And then you get to live the rollercoaster.

 

[ 00:34:28 ]I wasn’t happy with my 9-to-5. I decided to work 24-7. Yeah, exactly. Those 40 hours just wasn’t cut.

 

[ 00:34:36 ]If you had to sum up one piece of advice for a new business that just started now, what would that be?

 

[ 00:34:47 ]it’s not personal there’s nothing personal about this like it’s all everyone everyone is looking out for themselves and that’s okay like even even now i was sitting here i’m looking out for something for you guys i have an expectation and you guys have an expectation of me and that’s perfectly fine um it’s a business and it’s not personal and everyone that’s going to come to you is going to be selfish. And that’s fine. My staff is selfish. They want something. I’m selfish. I want something from you. It’s just not personal. It’s just all business. And so you have to approach it as a business. You have to look out for yourself. Everything is awkward the first time you do it. You just do it. After that, it’s easy. After that, you do it. I was very uncomfortable talking about money. People would come in and be like, how much are you charging for this? I’m like, and now I’m like, boom, these are my charges. And if you don’t like it, I’m sorry. But that’s the way it goes. And so that’s the biggest thing I would say as a first-time business owner is just understand the business, understand your self-worth. And it’s not personal. If a parent walks away from you and doesn’t want to train with you, if a kid walks away and doesn’t want to train with you,

 

[ 00:35:54 ]it’s not personal right they’re just looking out for themselves so yeah that’s awesome i like that that’s great yeah well thanks for coming on we really appreciate it i appreciate you guys having me it’s been fun yeah the time flew by holy cow